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Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Any issues that are tvOS specific
cosmoxl
Posts: 1271
Joined: 12 Dec 2015, 14:16

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by cosmoxl » 07 Mar 2018, 15:34

zoltan wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 13:20
Which is the difference between:
1) "Disable limited to full video rescalng" option in settings>video>acceleration and ...
2) "Use limited color range (16-235)" option in settings>system>video output?

And how do they interact with TvOS settings RGB high or low?

What is the contribution of each of these settings to the final output?
I'm going crazy to find the combination with no scaling.

Thanks
I don't know that answer but have you tried just using ycbcr instead of RGB? I get a better experience using that.

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davilla
Team MrMC
Posts: 3364
Joined: 26 Oct 2015, 17:01

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by davilla » 07 Mar 2018, 15:37

I guess time to ask, exactly what are you trying to achieve ?

zoltan
Posts: 14
Joined: 01 Mar 2018, 16:23

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by zoltan » 07 Mar 2018, 15:55

cosmoxl wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 15:34
zoltan wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 13:20
Which is the difference between:
1) "Disable limited to full video rescalng" option in settings>video>acceleration and ...
2) "Use limited color range (16-235)" option in settings>system>video output?

And how do they interact with TvOS settings RGB high or low?

What is the contribution of each of these settings to the final output?
I'm going crazy to find the combination with no scaling.

Thanks
I don't know that answer but have you tried just using ycbcr instead of RGB? I get a better experience using that.
Yes I tried. ycbcr (TvOS) acts like RGB High (converts to 16-235). If I set ycbcr, the only way to have in mrmc correct video levels is to leave 1 and 2 options above disabled. But I get levels <16 and >235 totally clipped and video levels are scaled twice.

User avatar
davilla
Team MrMC
Posts: 3364
Joined: 26 Oct 2015, 17:01

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by davilla » 07 Mar 2018, 16:06

If your video content is limited, as 99.9 percent is. then you will not see below or above the limited range.

Again, what are you trying to do ?

zoltan
Posts: 14
Joined: 01 Mar 2018, 16:23

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by zoltan » 07 Mar 2018, 16:08

davilla wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 15:37
I guess time to ask, exactly what are you trying to achieve ?
Thank you for your support. I would like to:

1) understand the difference between the 2 options written above and how/when they interact with the video content;
2) understand what is the best combination between mrmc settings/TvOS settings to achieve correct video levels without any scaling.

I suppose (but it is just my guess) that I achieved it by setting:
- TvOS: RBG low;
- "Disable limited to full video rescalng" enabled
- "Use limited color range (16-235)" disabled

However with the above settings I get crushed blacks and blown highlights when I use youtube app on ATV until I change the TvOS setting to ycbcr or RGB High, and that's a bit annoying.

Thanks

P.S. Take your time. I'm in no hurry. :-)

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davilla
Team MrMC
Posts: 3364
Joined: 26 Oct 2015, 17:01

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by davilla » 07 Mar 2018, 16:24

We have gone over this in the past. see viewtopic.php?f=15&t=962&start=10

For no scaling, leave

- "Disable limited to full video rescalng" disabled
- "Use limited color range (16-235)" disabled

And use AVFoundation for decode. Then video levels are untouched by MrMC and should be exactly like the native player.

VideoToolBox decoder will use the internal MRMC renderer for display. Leaving the above two settings disabled will result in no rescaling.

I avoid rgb output like the plague, too many unknowns.

cosmoxl
Posts: 1271
Joined: 12 Dec 2015, 14:16

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by cosmoxl » 07 Mar 2018, 16:27

zoltan wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 15:55
cosmoxl wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 15:34
zoltan wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 13:20
Which is the difference between:
1) "Disable limited to full video rescalng" option in settings>video>acceleration and ...
2) "Use limited color range (16-235)" option in settings>system>video output?

And how do they interact with TvOS settings RGB high or low?

What is the contribution of each of these settings to the final output?
I'm going crazy to find the combination with no scaling.

Thanks
I don't know that answer but have you tried just using ycbcr instead of RGB? I get a better experience using that.
Yes I tried. ycbcr (TvOS) acts like RGB High (converts to 16-235). If I set ycbcr, the only way to have in mrmc correct video levels is to leave 1 and 2 options above disabled. But I get levels <16 and >235 totally clipped and video levels are scaled twice.
How do you come to the conclusion that levels are scaled twice with this setup?

BTW, I completely agree with what Davilla just wrote. Use AVF... and RGB is too unpredictable.

zoltan
Posts: 14
Joined: 01 Mar 2018, 16:23

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by zoltan » 07 Mar 2018, 16:41

cosmoxl wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 16:27

How do you come to the conclusion that levels are scaled twice with this setup?

BTW, I completely agree with what Davilla just wrote. Use AVF... and RGB is too unpredictable.
I noticed that playing the black clipping test clip with this setup I can't se black levels <16 even if I raise the TV brightness level to max.

With the other setup (TvOS: RBG low - "Disable limited to full video rescalng" enabled - "Use limited color range (16-235)" disabled) I can see the blacker than black levels by raising the brightness.

So I guess that in the first case some scaling is operating somewhere...

zoltan
Posts: 14
Joined: 01 Mar 2018, 16:23

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by zoltan » 07 Mar 2018, 16:58

davilla wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 16:24
We have gone over this in the past. see viewtopic.php?f=15&t=962&start=10

For no scaling, leave

- "Disable limited to full video rescalng" disabled
- "Use limited color range (16-235)" disabled

And use AVFoundation for decode. Then video levels are untouched by MrMC and should be exactly like the native player.

VideoToolBox decoder will use the internal MRMC renderer for display. Leaving the above two settings disabled will result in no rescaling.

I avoid rgb output like the plague, too many unknowns.
That was my first setup. I wil check again but I think I get some scaling in this way.
Currently I have AVF and VTB both enabled. Should I disable VTB?
Thank you

cosmoxl
Posts: 1271
Joined: 12 Dec 2015, 14:16

Re: Use rgb limited range option works the other way round

Post by cosmoxl » 07 Mar 2018, 17:02

zoltan wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 16:58
davilla wrote:
07 Mar 2018, 16:24
We have gone over this in the past. see viewtopic.php?f=15&t=962&start=10

For no scaling, leave

- "Disable limited to full video rescalng" disabled
- "Use limited color range (16-235)" disabled

And use AVFoundation for decode. Then video levels are untouched by MrMC and should be exactly like the native player.

VideoToolBox decoder will use the internal MRMC renderer for display. Leaving the above two settings disabled will result in no rescaling.

I avoid rgb output like the plague, too many unknowns.
That was my first setup. I wil check again but I think I get some scaling in this way.
Currently I have AVF and VTB both enabled. Should I disable VTB?
Thank you
I disable VTB since AVF, for me, outputs proper levels. Raising brightness on TV shows that blacker than black is there, and whiter than white is there for me as well. I use ycbcr in tvOS settings.

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